rough notes:
-step forward (right now- playing with scale) (currently three metres)
-smaller paintings in her career. not bc of gender, some small work can be impactful, sometimes have to fight for space around the work. forces the viewer to bend in and look. Quite aggressive actually. When we whisper, then the stars fall down.
-studio visit about five years ago from a guy She really respects. Asked what her work - much easier for curators journalists to have a hook, didn’t feel like a natural thing to tease out artificially. all of these things are of equal importance. easier to consumption doesn’t need to think about necessarily. often Male, not the most progressive attitude. Phsysits, atoms two places at once, time .. occupying different positions at the same time as an artists. More about fluidity and embracing of voices that were previously excluded. more nuance and thoughtfulness..
-what she’s literally doing right now: idea of time.. When you look at a painting, inheriting in a. Second an artist hours of time.. on a painting, condensed. -nature of time is so complex, want to learn mechanics of time, the work doesn’t shy away from complex things. questions with no answers, -reading sculpting time / filmmaking.. he describes - two facets, time and memory, finite beings yet can’t see edges of being.. fascinating. -puts her work in three different tests, does what I’m making right now make sense to the historical cannons - is it authentic, me -does it matter now, has urgency about it. -not just philosophical , how we are socially conditioned, fast paced, acceptance, everything seems to be .. data presented in consumable chunks.. shallowness of data, this matters because . Existing in a time right now, politicians, Moment where, political rhetoric, as long as it sounds good, soundbite , hold validity. Slogan not based on truth. so important digging into it now. these paintings are almost a plea to slowing down and going back. opposite of rejection of expertise.
-making; irritating; reach for the surrealist label, often gets put upon, nothing implausible about scenarios that they make, logic that opens up, quote Philip guston: painting is not on a surface but a play that is imagined.. -fascinated by language, visual, language in any form. bc interested in it’s limits, Manet, emits gaps, her work so much information specific, one hair brush, but at the same time, edge of representation, but still know it’s a painting, not whole picture at all. -within each painting different kind of language, carved into, thick impasto, colour wheels layer upon layer transparent paint, to build up really thick, celebration of painting but also some areas more legible than others if you paint like this. hierarchy of attention as a viewer. Consider herself conceptual artist, painting exists in the mind in the viewer -painting is so problematic, art history has been taught, even now, particularly figurative representational, some people still have problems seeing conceptual art, reason why she employs it, thinks its perfect vehicle for now bc we live in such a complex world.
olivia: writer / published two books, overlap in its concerns. Using a medium , Death of novel, painting, using to explore things like the contemporary. immediately set in past.. in first book, in her head in past.. realised taking seriously, somehow the present is superficial, modern way of experiencing life, technology.. if you apply mobile phones, will tend to spoil a plot- linear narrative increasingly hard .. wanted to explore how that can be subverted.. how might you use a physical book, breaks down space and time,, experience.. wave of anxiety,, surveillance and technology. In real life. ___ reads , is by nature personal, lone figure, real world, writing of books as technology, tools to do things, suddenly the book was extension of herself, but also cut off feelings for it, links creative practice and anxiety ___ scrutiny, fuel but inspiration.. all information is there to be used right away like the internet, but can’t choose, can’t decide how to move through it.. novels and paintings both. with such technology, anxious people.. shape our tools, tools shape us,, idea that shaped by things we create.. central to her practice, can’t really not write about present ,, definitely feel, long form journalism, to reach an idea, sale is now so inhuman, uncanny and alien about using the internet, no line between online and real life.. human scale removed in interaction - feel disembodied.. there’s more and more place in finding human scale in everyday life.. -raise questions both her work and anj ‘the death of’ painting like it was created in another era, so much we think as modern feels like that, email, envelope, when something , the brain needs a design cue to understand what it is like the envelope for email, who is in charge, in how we see the world, coders, tech, maybe not great, interfaces that we use, kids these days find it difficult seeing things round corner or turning, bc everything is flat , screen, only happening in last 10 and 20 years, in writing find new forms. use these preprogrammed ways of interaction, symbols , ambiguous meanings..
-Zoë: worked out something as a part and together; Sadie Smith// ability to travel become multiple, actual proximity to your hand as you write it, painting, travel, reproduced.. -painting being interrogating the world, how does my artwork connect to the world? connectivity.. has to in some way connect to many many people : anj: there’s no point, making work for oneself, if there’s no viewer there’s no work, the viewer coming from elsewhere is a particular kind of viewer.. how paintings began, having something that can be recognised, of journey, reach.. symbols,, anj: struggled with before, think of her work as accessible on many levels, family doesn’t have interest in art, can look at her work and get something out of the work, if someone who knows art can experience on another level. of engagement. someone comes into the gallery, two seconds, experiences completely different painting looking ten minutes;; Olivia: when first writing novel, first tried historical novel, third person. Voice and it wasn’t working, part of what she was doing was removing her diary,, her self, lack of authenticity.. basically hide artist entirely in the process. Estrange people from reality, almost think they were reading a true story. Mappable to definite reality. when reader recognised something, then can estrange them.. describing iPhone and describing ,, jellied Brain,, brings that person into the painting in the familiar.. Zoë: normalcy, reminds you of prequitive, estranged but also very familiar.. meticulousness, conceptualism, the fantastical, disorder, role of fiction can play in selfhood.. reflects, rather than focus inwards, ask outwards,, to be about yourself but also look at the world, causation, kind of echo, how you manage that space -anj: always deny there’s anything about herself,, if using something she experienced,, someone close to her had a sex change, dealing with ideas of stereotypes, she would never think —Zoë: not biographical, being a human, body, inhabiting space in a sense,, portraits, -anj: time investigation : Olivia: used to seeing outward , force, when women make art that also can be autobiographical, in her case, using her biographical, no matter how big female artists make a world the telescope is turned back on her, compared to Male, // so self reflective bc no creative , talking about other things but acknowledging whats outside the frame, there’s a much happier exchange between those things,, impossible not to autobiographical detail in your work.. women being paid not that much money.. insert personal traumatic experience as a way to generate art, looks progressive,, but also beat women with it.. -Zoë: this is different territory, people confuse,, collaging information,, tactility,, other novelists voices collected as well.. histories of writing and painting.. Olivia: baggage of that,, female gaze in writing., __ ‘fragmentialia’ big waves of anxiety, images come and go, storehouse of time, exists simultaneously, strange images that come to her.. women at perhaps better at holding these images, socialised way of holding, rewarded for it, role of caring.. brains not being linear.. being able to hold these ideas at the same time.. more porous boundaries of ourself and others.. concept of private and public self in reienssance, only when you physically outside, public mode,, indoor and outdoor today same.. never leaving yourself at home now,, -zoe: painting’s That take three years to make, return to studio everyday, it lives there,, can’t see novel all at once,, studio time,, slow time.. is also something relate to act of making,, anj; question of writers block,, when get to studio, palette cleanse,, domestic routine with children,, and sitting in silence for twenty minutes,, once she starts, massive mission,, ready to go,, leaving herself voice notes.. writers block,, Male privilege,, cannot get ideas out fast enough,, actual making is quite intense,, very short breaks that she takes ,, production.. ;; Olivia: different mode of attention, separate self from real world,, eases in slowly,, even when you’re not working,, tiny part of brain,, always working, so much of what she does doesn’t look like work. can’t quantify,, twenty percent of her year writing, rest isn’t always like that, is she still writer if she’s not writing,, rejecting ideas,, in research.. having a dedicated space, one thing is to separate, and give permission, women especially have to give permission,, Zoë: when we whisper ,, stars fall down quote,, powerise extravert changes the world, undoing of that.. what is that quiet voice,, wonder about need to do that more,, constantly unfolding internet space, form of quiet. Olivia: enjoying painting, as pointless, only New Years resolution not be productive in January, approaching everything with utility, from extractive.. completely missing the point,, no new ideas, bc approaching like this.. sometimes doing nothing ‘how to do nothing’ book, all about actively be still,, not even mindfulness or optimising,, doing nothing, take yourself out that space, doing as a job, what should an artist be doing right now at this time.. the next exam, next achievement, when she writes according to this, she writes total crap, often achievement is not doing anything.. anj: relates, suffer from big sense of guilt, sisters are all doctors,, what did she do, very self indulgent,, pulling her weight as a citizen? Come to see cultural spaces like texts and essays, almost like a hospital, every time gone through really bad times,, can escape,, really provided some solice, role of art and culture is so important,, painful to live right now, complete uncertainty, overwhelming, stopped agonising that stuff, provide escapes for people. Olivia: you want to feel like you’re contributing not about utility but about affect, shifting a mood, but cannot quantify. Zoë: some people out there to fight for the right to make art, resisting modes of production,, resistance.. wondering what’s not allowed in writing and painting.. embellishment or decoration,, tattooing, degenerate,, your work really takes on, permitting very bejewelled elaborate crafting.. irritation of decorative, class and feminine,, seems to be still bubbling.. anj: also reading catalogue of exhibition.. criminal,? ornament?, wrote idea of modernism , which was so groundbreaking, has now floated down to good taste or even Ikea, when MA at goldsmiths, if it looks like art then don’t do it,, no embarrassment,, still some regressive snobberies around,, embroidery women,, massive cultural hangover about that,, don’t think we are encouraged to look at imagery with this awareness.. making this reaction to this generation of art.. Tracy Emins,, Saatchi was collecting, very consumable art, now, instagrammable certain traction,, attention span.. Olivia: things that are detailed and layered, idea of opposite of truthfulness instead of clear messages.. the journey to get to the point(constantly moving, world is moving) is as important as the point. Zoë: maximal moment we’re in Olivia: simple design, purpose, taste,, anj uses a lot of literary references.. and Olivia has visual ,, counterpoint ; often works really well , drawing those connections Zoë: the MCP can be visual as well as performance.. fluidity in language.. anj; tv was a glorious thing growing up.. depressing now,, love watching films.. Olivia: access to television.. four or five channels, Zoë: watching television being made.. relationship to literature.. Question: nothingness / void, to become something? anj; psychological tricks to jumpstart, after being primed white gesso, mix green gold transparent paint and purple, and makes this mid tone and its translucent, already in , painted on with rag.. already she’s starting.. seeing in the paint. if struggling, seeing stimulate, something always catches, compulsion to make,, Olivia; switching medium.. finding constraints,, for her, blank page, needs something to push against. Eg find someone’s titles, and think of something what you do, with that title, freedom can be paralysing.. never not collecting stuff,, seeing something in street, conversation,, three years later using it as material, has now a place.. you already have collected stuff, reassuring. dont gather bc you know it’s going to be useful.. Question: how do you end, finish a painting . Anj; painting at goldsmiths: if you feel sick, you just know it’s done, practice, know what you want to do in a work, sometimes it comes before you think, click. Olivia: sickness and nausea, overfamilarity, long for other challenges,, doesn’t represent you anymore,; but actually a good feeling.. space to make more work.. can tinker forever with a book , dangerous, but have to accept, a vision, will never match. The gap between the vision. and the finish, like a train, you gotta get off. It must be the end of the road.. twenty second moment, physically. / Zoë: how to start and how to end... /love of medium, death of it is vehicle of challenge, as a painting course, these things come up a lot. What to do when there’s such a history.